Israeli Rabbinical Court Has No Authorization

Elimelech Meisels

Elimelech Meisels

The Israeli Beis Din (IBD of Rabbis Shafran, Malinowitz and Gartner, claims that the Meisels’ seminaries are hunky dory and it is forbidden for any other seminary to poach the incoming 2014-2015-year students. The Chicago Beis Din maintains that students should not go there and that the staff were guilty of enabling Meisels and thus cannot be trusted. Yesterday, the Daas Torah blog of R. Daniel Eidensohn posted two long letters by the IBD full of thundering allegations that they requested this, that and the other from Chicago.

All these arguments are in the service of the claim that Chicago passed over jurisdiction but then did not give them the proof of the abuse. Hence the IBD claims they were correct in their finding that the seminaries were safe. Missing from their entire thumping, thundering missives was a single statement of proof that Chicago ever authorized the IBD to take over the case. A single image of a signed document would have been worth more than their thousands of words. I surmise they did not present it because they do not have it. #HalachaFail

Tomorrow night I will have more to say on pending lawsuits against the Meisels seminaries and their rabbinic enablers.

Advertisements

39 thoughts on “Israeli Rabbinical Court Has No Authorization

  1. Good, thank you YL, it is difficult and painful to stand up and negate our ‘g’dolai hador” or even some otherwise highly thought of Rebbeim. They are human and subject to faults, and even to financial considerations, or other non holy sources contributing to their psakei din. The Israeli IBD is embroiled over their head, IMHO, in a machloket that they never anticipated. Shame on them. Truly. busha cherpa shonda on the IBD. Perhaps they should be replaced. is there an age limit??? in US, various trusts have max. age limits for trustees, often 75, since some people’s judgment starts to fail, afilu if they do not yet show any signs whatsoever of Alzheimers. I am writing this, not knowing the ages of our 3 IBD sages. Perhaps someone can fill me in, perhaps, re this particular inyan, I am way way off base. Corruption can occur at any age…..

      • i was always taught to follow the money an important question to clear up here is who is hiring (paying) the IBD to be involved in this. you could ask that q about the CBD and we know the answer is this has been a BD working on these problems for 14 years and they are in well paid rabunus positions to lead the community’s that they are employed by (if they are paid at all for this side BD responsibility of there’s it is a small amount) contrast this with the IBD who the girls attending the sems are not from there communities, non of the daynim have solid well paying jobs, if suddenly they are hired to sit on a one time BD well there are a lot of chasunas to make it will save a trip to America… so it only makes sense that the IBD would only get involved if hired the CBD has no reason or budget to hire them so that leaves the meisels family that it would be kadie to spend a pretty penny to hire a BD to say the semanary is kosher this would explain why the IBD writes in its letter there main concern is to make sure the semas open also the whole confusion of who started the case and then contacted whom stems from this that the IBD (after being hired by meisels family) told the CBD that they are already taking care of this matter so the CBD does not need to get involved

  2. The problem may be naïveté. They cannot fathom what Meisels is being accused of.

    • The problem is NOT naivete. THe problem is corrupted thinking based on job and money considerations. The proof? The IBD “paskened” — if thats what you call such an untenable decision— that the seminaries are perfectly safe without even having the evidence they admit they needed from the CBD. How can a beit din paskan without having access to the evidence they demand and by so demanding, admit they need?!!!?! Their “psak” is a joke!

      Also, Malinowitz was siting shiva in America while the.Israeli beit din was doing their rushed and self-admittedly incomplete “investigation”. How can a dayan sign on a psak.of.such enourmous iimplications when he is siting shiva 6000 Miles away from the.beit.din’s cursorary hack job of an investigation?

      Money and jobs trump responible judicial protocol and preserving the safety and sanctity of young ladies neshamos.

  3. It all boils down to the fact that there are those amongst us who are of the belief that they are above the law. They believe, that as long as all their actions are preported to be “lesheim shomayim” they can basically get away with anything,whether it’s stealing from the government or turning a blind eye to the rapist davening in front of the amud.

    We should always remember that the ONLY way sex offenders get away with their crimes is because the powers that be allow them to. If the first time Meisels stayed out all night with a student, someone had reported him we would not be having this debate right now.

  4. YL, can you please explain how the IBD didn’t have jurisdiction when the CBD themselves wrote:

    “Because these institutions and Mr. Meisels are located in Israel and not the United States, a distinguished Israeli beis din consisting of Rabbis Menachem Mendel Shafran, Chaim Malinowitz, and Tzvi Gartner has assumed responsibility for this matter.”

    Wouldn’t it seem that the CBD did give jurisdiction and was planning on cooperating with the IBD but then something happened and they changed their mind?

    If yes, what happened that changed their mind?

    • Notice the passive construction, “assumed,” not “we asked” or “we delegated.” Moreover, Chicago never surrendered explicitly or implicitly their control over any aspects involving the us, starting with their ability to render psak about the suitability of the seminaries. The very same letter, on their own authority, and on the basis of their own investigations, led them to rule against attending them. Thus it was implicit that they might lift the ban on attending is necessary changes occurred. It was IBD that crossed CBD by attempting to nullify CBC ruling and declaring anyone could attend and it was wrong for CBD to say otherwise. It is even possible that CBD wasn’t even happy about Israeli beit din coming into being but was making the polite best of it as long as it didn’t intrude on CBD’s domain or rulings. Obviously, the moment Israel effectively nullified Chicago, they lost all tolerance for the usurpers.

      • If the CBD was expecting to retain some control or wasn’t happy about the IBD getting involved; they wouldn’t have used such a passive verbiage or even mentioned them in their letter. The fact that they did, leads me to believe that originally they did give some form of control/responsibility to the IBD and when they weren’t happy with the results they pulled their support.

        At a minimum, both Beis Dins are guilty of poor communication.

    • i was always taught to follow the money an important question to clear up here is who is hiring (paying) the IBD to be involved in this. you could ask that q about the CBD and we know the answer is this has been a BD working on these problems for 14 years and they are in well paid rabunus positions to lead the community’s that they are employed by (if they are paid at all for this side BD responsibility of there’s it is a small amount) contrast this with the IBD who the girls attending the sems are not from there communities, non of the daynim have solid well paying jobs, if suddenly they are hired to sit on a one time BD well there are a lot of chasunas to make it will save a trip to America… so it only makes sense that the IBD would only get involved if hired the CBD has no reason or budget to hire them so that leaves the meisels family that it would be kadie to spend a pretty penny to hire a BD to say the semanary is kosher this would explain why the IBD writes in its letter there main concern is to make sure the semas open also the whole confusion of who started the case and then contacted whom stems from this that the IBD (after being hired by meisels family) told the CBD that they are already taking care of this matter so the CBD does not need to get involved

      • I have no reason to suspect any of the three rabbonim on IBD of taking bribes. I am pretty sure that Malinowitz and Shafran can easily get additional respectable paid employment if their incomes are insufficient. I just don’t know anything about Gartner. Malinowitz has one of the largest shuls in Beit Shemesh. R. Shafran, one of the most highly respected dayanim of the Bnei Brak Beis Din of R. Nissin Karelitz, regularly works for free. Between midnight and around 2 a.m. on most weekdays he operates a walk in beis din with zero fees. This does not sound to me like a man who takes bribes.

        In my experience, there is one culprit with motives who misleads others and rabbis are too inclined to trust their peers without critical scrutiny. Even dayanim.

        Most rabbonim, like most humans, are biased to protecting their institutions and those of their peers including yeshivas, seminaries, etc.

        Malinowitz has a lousy history of protecting molesters. In contrast, Gartner and Shafran have written important halachic rulings advancing the powrs of victims of child sexual abuse. I do suspect that they find it harder to deal with young adult women who they believe were seduced but are culpable. they understand that the child is not to blame but may feel the young adult women are to blame. they probably don’t understanding the role of charismatic figures, the nature of grooming, and enabling by other staff, and the intimidation of young adults.

        • I am not suggesting they are taking bribes I think they were hired by the seminarys to over see that all is kosher there it would be nice to be mevair why this BD was put to task taking care of this affair they seem to have no direct shiychus

            • the only language i am semiliterate in is yinglish there is no punctuation or grammer or spelling rules in that language. i do not have the time or resources to learn a new language at the age of 30 #yeshivaheducation

            • But you owe that to others if you take up commenting space and people’s time. No one is asking for perfect. But some effort would greatly facilitate the interaction for others and would better allow you to get your points across. You are writing in Yeshivish which is primarily English. i get the sense that you are a native English speaker. You can master the rudiments with modest effort at learning and proofing.

            • Start with putting periods at the end of your sentences. To make it simple, a sentence is the end of one thought, before the beginning of another. A sentence which is a question ends with a question mark instead of a period. Please follow those 2 simple rules out of mentchlichkeit and consideration to readers. Thank you.

  5. Deleted for vulgarity and obnoxiousness. If you have a legitimate question, phrase it as such. Otherwise I will not dignify it with a reply. Yerachmiel Lopin

  6. Why are we bothering with a discussion of jurisdiction and other side issues???

    As a parent of a teenage daughter I need facts, not opinions.

    Fact: Mr. EM is a pig in a rabbinic jacket who has admitted improper conduct to the CBD.

    Fact: Senior staff members who ignored and even helped hide his perverse behavior are still in positions of authority at the schools.

    Fact: The head of one of the schools sent out by email a nauseating call for students with information about EM’s late night kiruv work to keep the information to themselves or risk gehenom for delaying the arrival of Moshiach.

    Why in earth would I be interested in the pronouncement of these three men (of the IBD)???

    Do we really need their opinions about the safety of these schools? Da’as Toirah!!!

    How’s about using a little da’as of our own??? Why do you think Gd gave you a brain? Just to memorize R Malinowitz’s phone number so you call and ask his opinion about crossing Sixth Avenue against the light or drinking a cup of bleach???

    What is the matter with you people??? Gd gave your children parents so they can be safe until they are old enough to know on their own not to stick pencils in their ears or ride in the back of a Ford Pinto. He gave you a brain to use.

    USE IT.

    • Seems to me that what you consider facts is based on your opinion. You have no evidence to any if your “facts” (which a prerequisite for being a fact) except from what you read on blogs. Something to think about.

      • Apparently you have not read the posts to date carefully including the documents such as Kahan’s insane letter. I understand that you are of the camp that chooses to believe the IBD and doesn’t even feel a need to consider the logic and arguments of the other side. I can see no point in you or other readers arguing with you.

    • But “Daas Toirah” is Hashem’s will, manifested through the Pope, I mean, through Rabbanim who are also called “Gedolim.” So, Hashem just hasn’t made up his mind yet if our daughters’ lives should be risked for the sake of saving an institution or jobs. Give Hashem some time, he’s working out the details. A brain? No! Chas V’Shalom! That’s for Goyim. WE have “Daas Toirah”!! [End of sarcasm]

  7. I asked someone close to the IBD to clarify their opinion for me. He told me that the IBD asked the CBD to work together for a Beis Din Murchav but was rejected by the CBD. The IBD was never asked to look into the presumed guilt of EM. They were only asked to oversee the feasibility of maintaining the functioning of the schools (I don’t have direct knowledge of the scope of this mandate). The bottom line from the individual I spoke with is that EM is clearly not involved in the schools has no access to the institutions or the students and therefore the schools are deemed to be safe. If people want to pasul the schools by pasuling any or all of the staff on the basis of facilitating the avla then they really need to step up to the plate with some names and founded accusations including some that indicate that such culpability renders them and the entire institution a risk to the girls.

    • Clearly the CBD is not convinced Meisels and his enablers are out. I hear the IBD has refused to share any documentation to prove he is out. Till that is established CBD has no reason to lift its psak. In fact the IBD has never even officially declared that the seminaries are sold. Nor have they even accepted the Chicago psak about Meisels’ conduct. With such obfuscation and resistance I would wonder if the real agenda of the IBD is to kasher the seminaries quickly. Fantastic. This is like the dream of ever sleazy treyf caterer: a mashgiach who hands over the rubber stamp, needs thick, think lenses and shows up to work without his eyeglasses.

      • Just for the sake of being correct, I was told by the IBD that they did believe and accept the misconduct which the CBD accused Meisles of. But they asked for NO evidence or a re-trial. Just blindly accepted.

        Either way, now they are asking for info and saying Chicago has no power to rule the case.

        I’m sorry, this is so twisted. When I spoke to the IBD on the phone, I was just like in my head “huh? How does that make ANY sense?”

        And that was after asking a lot of questions to rlly get to the bottom of everything…

        • I think it makes sense if you start from the premise that the IBD was created for the purpose of giving the seminaries a clean bill of health post-Meisels so that parents wouldn’t demand their money back and force the seminaries to close. Logic can get twisted when you start with a conclusion and have to find a way to get there, especially if inconvenient facts arise on the way. That is what I meant in my earlier reference to “Torah from Wonderland”: in the trial scene at the end of Lewis Carroll’s “Alice in Wonderland,” the Queen of Hearts declares, “Sentence first, verdict afterwards!”

          Perhaps the IBD rabbis honestly believed that Meisels was the sole problem and nothing needed to be done but provide reassurance. Since an ad-hoc BD cannot issue a ruling without the consent of opposing litigants, apparently the fiction was created that R’ Feldman represented the victims as against the seminaries. The IBD knew there were serious accusations against Meisels, but hadn’t heard the evidence that other faculty and staff had covered up for him, so they were taken by surprise when the CSBD didn’t accept their conclusion that removing Meisels fixed everything. Since the whole reason for the existence of the IBD had been to declare the seminaries tahor, it had to find a way to argue that its ruling took precedence over that of the CSBD. Scrambling for an argument, the IBD and those whose interests align with it have been telling less than the whole truth. I think that hypothesis explains most, if not all, of the evidence so far.

  8. Just think where we would be without Yerachmiel? Everyone would be in the dark about what happened here. EM would slink back into the seminary after a short period of time and be back in business. No wonder “they” assur smartphones and the internet.
    One doesn’t have to be Sherlock Holmes to figure this out.

See Commenting policy ( http://wp.me/pFbfD-Kk )

Fill in your details below or click an icon to log in:

WordPress.com Logo

You are commenting using your WordPress.com account. Log Out / Change )

Twitter picture

You are commenting using your Twitter account. Log Out / Change )

Facebook photo

You are commenting using your Facebook account. Log Out / Change )

Google+ photo

You are commenting using your Google+ account. Log Out / Change )

Connecting to %s